100 Pro Death Penalty Quotes by Supporters of Capital Punishment



Execute the guilty. Honor the victims. Educate the uninformed.

To murder an innocent human is a tragedy; to execute a killer is a victory!

Pro Death Penalty Resource Community - http://www.off2dr.com/ Established in March of 2006, this is an interactive Pro Death Penalty site and we are here to provide you with accurate death penalty information, pending executions calendar, up to date case histories, landmark cases, history of the death penalty and current statistics.

Well, if your logic holds true, then we must abandon life in prison without parole because a in the realm of infinite possibility an "innocent" person may rot in prison until they die...an "innocent" person may die during any term of imprisonment. Innocent people die every single day in car crashes, but you aren't going to stand in the way of people driving automobiles are you?

Out of the 832-850 people that have been executed over the past 28 years...not one single case of a "wrongful" execution. There isn't one in the entire 20th century or at least the second half.

 

No, please feel free to find one documented case of a wrongful execution. You can’t presume it is the case without evidence and then call me naïve for stating the same fact that Paul Cassell pointed out about there not being a documented case of a wrongful execution over the second half of the Twentieth Century. Between 832-850 executions in 28 years versus some 500,000-600,000 homicides. You do the math! Yes, in capital cases, it takes an average of 10 years and 6 months to carry out the sentence. I’ve seen cases where people had been on death row for 20 years and more. We allow defendants in capital cases to have ample opportunity to appeal, appeal again, and again in addition to clemency hearings. To think an innocent person is just going to somehow get accused, tried, convicted, and have the conviction upheld repeatedly by appeals courts is naïve in the extreme. You don’t mind if a person is wrongfully left to rot until they die in prison, but you are opposed to capital punishment. You don’t mind if they are sent to prison and killed. Where is your heart when we have innocent people die every day of every year? Its funny how a handful of exonerations emboldens people to ignore the fact that it shows the systems of checks, usually appeals courts, works.

Conservative Coulter Fan

Friday, January 8, 2010

Neither Deterrence nor False Convictions are Valid Arguments For or Against the Death Penalty

The rate of innocence is not an argument against the death penalty. Anyone using it that way must stop using any form of transportation until the problem of accidental deaths in crashes has been "solved." We need a moratorium on cars, trucks, planes, subways, bicycling and walking. These kill 1000 times as many people as the death penalty, and 5000 times as many innocent people as the death penalty. These crashes kill 40,000 people who have committed no crime, without procedural due process, without trial. They made the mistake of driving over black ice. They are dispatched by crushing and slicing by metal edges emerging during the crash. There were over 10 times as many children executed by by vehicles, as they walked, as there were death penalties carried out.

No. The rate of innocence is being used as a pretext to abolish the death penalty. The abolitionists will use the slightest mistake or imperfection to try to shit the death penalty down. Therefore the use of the rate of innocence represents a form of bad faith. Bad faith gives moral justification to invalidate the advocate.


Supremacy Claus is a fictional character. The mother gave birth during a difficult Constitutional Law examination in law school. Supremacy has a younger brother, Establishment, and an older sister, Full Faith. The cousin is famous, Santa.

Years ago I was an opponent of the death penalty and had subscribed to the many arguments against its use.  It is inhumane, not worthy of a civilized society.  The wrong person might be executed.  No other advanced society continues to execute, only countries like Iran or Communist China.  It is given unfairly, only to the poor and minorities.  There is no evidence that it is a deterrent.  It is legalized murder by the state, little different than the act of the criminal, (the most absurd of all the arguments).  A life sentence serves the purpose just as well. 

And on and on go the tired arguments from watery intellects that appeal to emotion over reason.  I grow more conservative with age and many of the views I hold today I would have considered ridiculous twenty years ago.  I read somewhere once that any man who at the age of 18 is not a liberal has no heart; and any man who at the age of 35 is not a conservative has no mind.  I think of that quote whenever I hear a liberal argue about anything, especially the death penalty.

The death penalty is just.  What good is a society that does not proclaim the right to life as one of the ultimate values?  A person who wantonly takes the life of an innocent human being should pay the ultimate price, if the sacredness of life is to have any meaning at all.

The focus should be on the life of the innocent and the death penalty a statement by society that for certain acts, a person forfeits any right to a life of their own.  Life is sacred, and despite the liberal mindset that abhors passing judgments or making distinctions between good and evil, the value of an innocent life over one of a cold blooded murderer must be acknowledged.

It is not the death penalty that cheapens life or makes the society that employs it barbaric.  There was nothing barbaric about the execution of Mr. Graham.  What is barbaric, as well as tragic and pitiful, is the thinking that fails to make the distinction between the lives of Mr. Graham and the life of the young girl he was responsible for ending.  It is the society that fails to make that distinction, in a way that is dramatic and without equivocation, which is truly the barbaric one.

Richard W. Byrne witnessed the execution of Andre Graham in Virginia on 9 December 1999.

Favors capital punishment

February 18, 2011

I've read that murderers want to return to Iowa, as they know Iowa doesn't have capital punishment. The majority of Iowans are in favor of capital punishment.

Marvin Fawcett of Goldfield, Iowa wrote to http://www.messengernews.net

Death Penalty Essay on 14 May 2009 -

The anti-death penalty activists in this country would have you believe that every time a murderer is executed the justice system has just committed murder as well. They would have you believe that every person on death row is a victim. What they don’t talk about is what that person did to get onto death row. They forget about the people that where killed, and the people whose lives where affected by the murders; these are the real victims. They had a right to live just like every else in the world but their lives where snuffed out by a murderer. In my opinion, every one has a right to live, but as soon as you murder another human being you forfeit that right. I cannot see a convicted felon as some sort of victim, because it was his own actions that brought about his fate, not the actions of another person.

Death Penalty Essay on 14 May 2009 -

Some people would argue that putting a murderer to death will not bring their victims back to life, or console their victims family, so what is the point? Well, putting someone in prison for the rest of their lives, or any other punishment for that matter, won’t bring their victims back to life either. So do you suggest we just don’t punish the killer for his actions? What punishment is supposed to do is prevent the killer from ever killing again, and what better way to do that than to take their own life away from them. If the most severe penalty a person can receive is to spend the rest of his/her life in jail, then what do you do when this is no longer enough? For example, a New York prisoner named Lemuel Smith, while serving six life sentences for his various crimes, including murder, strangled a female security guard, then mutilated and dismembered her body. Because New York has no death penalty, there is nothing that can be done to punish him beside another meaningless life sentence (Koch 562). What better way to preserve innocent life than to eliminate the people that would seek to destroy it? As for consoling the victims family, true, the death of their loved ones murderer may not make them feel better, but at least they can rest easy knowing that the killer is dead and gone instead of sleeping soundly in a prison bed.

Death Penalty Essay on 14 May 2009 -

What would you do if Osama Bin Laden walked into the room right now? Most people would say they would kill him for the crimes he committed against our country. This is the same thing that the family’s and friends of most murder victim’s feel about the person that took their loved one away from them. Then the anti-death penalty activists complain that the death penalty is cruel and unusual. They don’t like the quick and painless death that is awaiting the convicted murderer. They cite the way the prisoner is treated, the way he has to wait for the inevitable. I hope that this is the most terrifying experience of his/her life. While it is not possible to let victims family’s personally strangle the murderer, they will know that the killer felt, at least a small part, the fear that their victims felt just before they where brutally killed. Is the death penalty barbaric? No: raping, beating, torturing and killing people is barbaric. Fast, effective, painless execution of someone convicted of the aforementioned crimes is not barbaric; it is justice.

Death Penalty Essay on 14 May 2009

In conclusion, I hope that next time you hear about a death penalty being carried out that you will be able to see through the media about the murderer being a victim, and remember who the real victim’s are. The death penalty is justice; it is not wrong. Think about the horrible crimes that the person committed to get himself on death row and remember that they brought this upon themselves. I value human life, and the best way to preserve it is to send a message to those people that would seek to destroy it; we will not tolerate murder.

Admin I on Customwritings.com http://www.customwritings.com/blog/sample-essays/death-penalty-essay.html

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

TheHuntsman

08/05/2011 10:15 AM

There are two fundamental arguments against the death penalty for murder which compel me not to support its reintroduction.

1. The criminal justice system is not perfect and mistakes are made. Innocent people will be killed by the State. That is unconscionable.

2. The People and The State have a considerable interest in ensuring that those guilty of murder are convicted of that offence. Yet Juries will sometimes, when faced with a Defendant who engenders sympathy for himself/herself,  baulk at convicting a guilty person because of that sympathy or because they do not trust The Home Secretary to have the same sympathy as themselves for the Defendant.

In the first instance the very greatest of injustices will take place: the conviction of the innocent and their unjust killing.

In the second instance the guilty will go free, prehaps to kill again.

strangerheremyself

08/05/2011 11:12 AM

The guilty already go free, to kill again. A 1997 Home Office report records that 362 ‘life licensees released between 1972 and 1990 were reconvicted of a standard list offence within 5 years. Of those released 66 had been convicted of a grave offence by the end of 1995’. Another report records 30 homicide convictions between 1997/8 and 2007/8 of people already convicted of homicide.
http://rds.homeoffice.gov.uk/r...
http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/r...

Donna Wilson murdered by already convicted murderer: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/staffordshire/6296201.stm

‘A convicted killer who murdered two of his neighbours …’: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-derbyshire-14189216

‘Wright fired a final, fatal shot into his neck. … Wright, who had already served a life sentence for a murder he committed in 1971’: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/bradford/8586576.stm

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

pesedah

08/05/2011 01:51 PM

can you imagine the violence that would ensue once we started hanging Is-Rad terrorists? Try and quantify how many more would die.  Murder is never right, whether by a  drug crazed gunman, a terrorist or a Norwegian psychopath. Neither can it be right to respond by murdering the murderers. Human life is scared from he moment of conception until natural death.

marxbrother

08/05/2011 02:31 PM

Cobblers.

It is my firm belief that by ones own actions one may forfeit the right to life and/or freedom.

Human life is not sacred to murderers. Why should their lives be any more sacred?

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

Sad But Mad Lad

08/05/2011 11:16 AM

All those who are for the death penalty - are you willing to have the executioner executed if an innocent was executed?

Or if not the executioner since they are only following orders, then the solicitors and barristers and the jury and the judge who ensured the innocent person was found guilty. It would only be right and proper since they in effect murdered someone through common purpose.

dickgreendoxon

08/05/2011 11:50 AM

Good idea..........and when our military kill civilians in one of our many overseas  invasions, we could have mass executions at the MoD.

bubbles1

08/05/2011 11:22 AM

Look, so many of you use this argument that an innocent just maybe killed.

For goodness sake, give the system some credit , so mistakes get made, but to clear out our jails  [which are full of evil criminals ] & or to stop further killings .........you should be more pragmatic.

I bet you don't agonise so much over 'collateral' war damage.

Which is far greater in number !

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

mythought

08/05/2011 11:18 AM

It is interesting how few of the comments here say anything about the information in the article, evidence that capital punishment is effective in preventing crime and saving lives.  Of course, the criminal justice system will always be far from perfect, as will everyone in the world.  We can't use that as a reason to allow convicted murderers, etc to live to murder again and again.  What about those innocent lives?  Are they not worth saving?  The thought of an innocent person dying as a result of a wrong decision in the criminal justice system is awful.  But, the reality of innocent lives being lost on a much larger scale, because we are not dealing with crime as we should, is more awful.  We devalue human life and undermine confidence in justice when we allow people to murder and then live to murder again. 

It seems that there has been a huge move away from punishment of all kinds in the last 50-100 years.  What is the result?  Western civilisation imploding morally and economically.

The death penalty should be restored.  It should be used sparingly.  I believe that the threat of capital punishment for capital crimes will be a deterrent to crime.  We owe it to all those countless people (and their families) who have lost their lives needlessly because of well intentioned but misguided views on this issue.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

strangerheremyself

08/05/2011 11:25 AM

Have you observed how death-penalty opponents do their utmost to make the victim vanish? While sometimes almost poetic in begging sympathy for the convicted murderer, not one word can they spare for the victims. They routinely depict the executed as if immaculately conceived and without sin, rather than meeting their end as a consequence of murdering another human being.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

eviltory

08/05/2011 11:22 AM

Rather the guilty go free than an innocent man be punished.

The one and only argument needed against the death penalty: what if you convict an innocent? Damned hard to apologize to a corpse, people.

kingorry

08/05/2011 02:55 PM

Not a very compelling argument. The average murderer is out of prison in a little over a decade, hard to explain that to their victim's corpse or their family.

strangerheremyself

08/05/2011 11:32 AM

It is hard to apologize to a corpse: have you tried apologizing to the at least 30 dead at the hands of already convicted murderers?
http://rds.homeoffice.gov.uk/r...
http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/r...

If you research the history of capital punishment in Britain, you will find that our record of executing the guilty is extremely good. Meanwhile, convicted murderers have killed again and committed other crimes, in one case raping a 10-year-old boy: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/new...

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

bubbles1

08/05/2011 11:24 AM

Nonsense. 
A guilty man free to kill many ,  more than one killed by the state?

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

Roy Ellor

08/05/2011 12:25 PM

Would you still be making the same argument if the innocent person executed was your brother/sister/child/spouse/parent/friend?

If you cannot separate sentencing policy from execution (and our lamentably poor record in sentencing decisions) then you can't argue the case. The two issues need debating separately but simultaneously as a sanction of life without parole needs to be made available as an alternative to execution.

strangerheremyself

08/05/2011 01:02 PM

And if one of the 30 dead at the hands of an already convicted murderer ‘was your brother/sister/child/spouse/parent/friend?’

Also, three of those 30 died in prison (the report does not specify if the victims were Prison Officers or inmates), so life without parole has its problems.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

Roy Ellor

08/05/2011 12:27 PM

The British practice was three clear Sundays absent appeals.

However, would you be happy if it was you or one of your close family on the rope as a result of wrongful conviction? 

truth please. Yes or no.

strangerheremyself

08/05/2011 12:42 PM

I understand the three weeks allowed the process of appeals; appeals did not extend this period.

Firstly, I refer you to my previous comments about 1) differentiating between ‘factual innocence’ and ‘legal innocence’—they differ substantially. Thus the chances of myself or anyone of my acquaintance (i.e. law-abiding, functioning citizens) being wrongly accused of murder is somewhere between minute and non-existent; 2) the greater risk incurred of suffering violent crime at the hands of previously convicted murderers and still greater risk at the hands of those with no cause to fear the ultimate penalty.

Secondly, life is about balancing risk, and simply by being a British citizen we risk (however remotely) one day being subject to conscription and sent to fight and die in a war. I am willing to accept that risk (indeed, I’ve already served), and also the vanishingly small risk of my being wrongly accused of a capital crime. I am not willing to accept the risk of suffering crime at the hands of already-convicted murderers—although you oblige the British population and every foreign visitor to suffer that risk.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

hnick

08/05/2011 12:46 PM

Oh here we go again.  It must be the silly season. Not much news going on so dig up some report.

As for the idea under discussion - yet more silliness.  You may get the guilty, but - and this has happened time and time again - you will end up killing the innocent too.

Nor does the death penalty act as a deterrent.  Despite the death penalty there are still killers on the streets of America.

If you want to seriously reduce killings, I suggest you look at examples of countries with low kill rates and no death penalty (they do exist) to see what they are doing right.  I suspect it has something to do with the right social and economic climate and education and morality.

Gary Murray

08/05/2011 01:54 PM

Some US states which do not have the death penalty have lower rates -yes the always did. Some countries have low murder rates because they are historical less violent countries than others.

northumbrianmariner

08/05/2011 01:12 PM

Most of this is mere assertion.  The death penalty does not act as a deterrent?  This might be what you want to believe, but it is almost certainly untrue.  If it was, why did the murder rate in this country rise disproportionate to all inputs, such as population increase and general crime rate, after the abolition of the death penalty?  Murder rates had been rising slowly throughout the 20th century, but they really took off after abolition was imposed on an unwilling country.

Killing the occasional innocent is not a decisive argument against the death penalty, if on other counts that penalty works, which the evidence suggests it does.  As a society we accept, for example, the deaths of innocent soldiers, and even civilians, if it is necessary to protect society. 

Also, there is a cathartic effect, greatly beneficial to society as a whole in the capital punishment of pre-meditated murder.  The death penalty, paradoxical though it may seem, emphasises the sanctity of human life.

I have looked at, and lived in, societies with low murder rates: Japan and Singapore.  Both have the death penalty, a punishment almost wholly supported by the people of both countries, as I think, it would be here.  Will the left, which hates liberty, let us put it to the vote?

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

strangerheremyself

08/05/2011 03:01 PM

Is it acceptable to you that Donna Wilson died so that a convicted murderer should live?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/eng...
Is it acceptable to you that a 10 year old is raped so that a convicted murderer should live?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/new...
Is it acceptable to you that a 19 year old woman only narrowly escapes being tortured to death so that a convicted murderer should live?
http://www.thisislocallondon.c...

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

Gregyank

08/05/2011 02:51 PM

The scum that killed those kids in Norway did not want to die. He wanted to make a political statement and after his arrest one of his earliest concerns was access to a PC so he can get on with the next phase of his political struggle. My opinion is that the death penalty under these extraordinary circumstances would have deterred this individual who's every breath is an insult to civilization.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

Expatnhappy

08/05/2011 02:51 PM

The death penalty "works" every time a murderer is put to death. Capital punishment is not the correct punishment for all murders, but for certain types of murder, in particular the murder of children or of more than one person on separate occasions, or the murder of a stranger, what is the US are category 1 capital murder cases, then it is the only proper punishment. The alternative: whole life sentences in which the killer is incarcerated for ever with no possibility of parole, are sadistic: a really cruel and unusual punishment if ever there was one but one which can never allow the families to forgive the perpetrator, since their loved one is dead and the killer is not. It is really very simple. People say that there is a danger of wrongful convictions. Well it is for the legal system to reduce those to a minimum and for any of those unlucky enough to be put to death for a murder they didnt commit, to have the grace to admit that their deaths are a price worth paying for a better society. In the same way the loved ones of innocent persons who die in horrific accidents on motorways have to accept that the inevitability of one or two terrible accidents is the price society is prepared to pay for a better road transport system.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

Bodaniel

08/05/2011 04:52 PM

Tell it to Angela Cannings, Donna Anthony, Mark Dallagher, Sean Hodgson and the Cardiff Three among many others. Real people with real lives. They would have hanged. Tell them their lives were worth sacrificing. I'd like to tell you to tell Sally Clark, Kevin Callan, Stefan Kiszko and Anthony Steel but sadly their health suffered so much after time in jail for murders they did not commit they died decades early than they should have.

danielfg

08/05/2011 04:58 PM

Bodaniel

Compare them with the 800 people murdered every year. I have every sympathy for your opinion but one cannot argue with facts.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

danielfg

08/05/2011 02:59 PM

A few statistics from the House of Commons library of cases initially recorded as homicide by the police per year - the charges may have been altered before trial:

1946     347

1969     395     when hanging was stopped

1997     738

In the 23 years till 1969 there was an annual increase of 58.

In the 28 years from 1969 to 1997 the increase was 343.

And they say that hanging doesn't work.

The figures before 1969 do not represent the number of people hanged - many of those must have been reduced to manslaughter, as execution was a mandatory punishment for murder - the judge had no discretion, which was left to the Home Secretary to grant a reprieve. I was here in 1946 and on the day of execution all the newspapers carried banner headlines that "today is execution day". There were in fact very few executions but those headlines emphasised the danger prospective criminals would face.

There were no long drawn out appeals - only six weeks were allowed between sentencing and execution.

People say that innocent people may be hanged but that would be nothing compared to the 800 innocents murdered every year.

Having said that, whatever Parliament decides they have no power to reintroduce hanging as it was banned by the European Court of Human Rights.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

strangerheremyself

08/05/2011 05:26 PM

Andrew Dawson: murdered a 91-year-old man in 1982. Released, he then murdered John Matthews, 66, and Paul Hancock, 58, in 2010.
Shaun Clarke murdered Patricia Sykes, 27, in 1988. Released, he then murdered Donna Wilson, 30, in 2007.
Ernest Wright beat Trevor Hale to death in 1971. Released, he then shot to death Neville Corby, 42, and shot and wounded Craig Freear, 31.

That’s three examples for starters.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

brock

08/05/2011 04:23 PM

and with satisfying symmetry, an innocent person wrongly convicted of murder will be saved the unpleasant prospect of being wrongly convicted again

strangerheremyself

08/05/2011 04:32 PM

And with rather less satisfying symmetry, an innocent person murdered by an already convicted murderer will not be murdered again by another already convicted murderer.

Where do I sign the petition to resurrect Donna Wilson? Or Maria Stubbings? Or Hazel Dix? Or Neville Corby? Or John Matthews or Paul Hancock?

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

strangerheremyself

08/05/2011 04:55 PM

Donna Wilson, Maria Stubbing, Hazel Dix. They were human beings. They deserved better than to die at the hands of convicted murderers.

Donna Wilson was engaged to be married. She worked as a warden in elderly care home. She was a law-abiding and contributing citizen—an asset to the community. She should not have been exposed to the risk that you, and people like you, forced her to be subject to.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

You really are a bottom-dweller aren't you - mawkishly invoking details of murder victims' lives just to bolster your tawdry case for the state killing its own citizens.

No-one condones or even 'understands' murder - but those of us who are a bit more civilised than you just believe that killing (whether by a murderer or by the state) is wrong.

strangerheremyself

08/05/2011 05:07 PM

That you so easily resort to abuse rather than civilised rebuttal says much about you and your cause.

Death-penalty opponents do their utmost to make the victim vanish. While almost poetic in begging sympathy for convicted murderers, not one word can be spared for the victims. The executed are routinely depicted as if immaculately conceived and without sin, rather than meeting their end as a consequence of murdering another human being.
See: ‘Fact Suppression and the Subversion of Capital Punishment’, by Lester Jackson, Ph.D.: http://ssrn.com/abstract=13461...

I simply try and counter that propaganda by reminding that for every murderer there is at least one victim, and that victim had a life—breathed, had hopes, enjoyed the sun’s warmth; until all that was taken from them by a murderer.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

So what would you do with a John Cooey sparky?

There are some vermin that need to be eradicated.

Handwringing is only creating more crime and violence.

Face reality- for the average person, prison is a scary proposition- but these guys don't care.

For them, its a better prospect than being on the outside. 3 meals a day, all bills paid, surrounded by like minded buddies= happy days.

strangerheremyself

08/05/2011 05:14 PM

And death-penalty opponents try and make themselves feel better by pretending that the victim does not exist; see article linked.

How many actual arguments have you made on this thread, as opposed to simply posting insults?

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

theseaoon

08/05/2011 04:40 PM

There could be an easy way to decide if a death sentence is safe and that is DNA. If a capital case is proven by DNA confirming that the suspect (don't you just love that word) is without doubt the culprit then the trial should include the death penalty as an option for the jury, if no DNA is proven then the death penalty should not be an option. However my take on it is if someone kills another in cold blood for a crime of theft or malice or rape or whatever, if convicted including DNA proof they should be executed after only one attempt to overturn the trial result as revenge, yes revenge. Take them out of the system because they have lost the right to be part of civilisation and why should we pay to keep them alive for years putting guards lives at risk? If these statistics are half right it makes a case to reinstate the death penalty in the UK.....but of course its only make believe because of all the bleeding heart liberals cracking on about human rights. My feelings on human rights are for the victims and families of victims. They want revenge they want these animals to be exterminated.....exterminate....exterminate....exterminate.....Dr, Dr....its the.....arrrrrrr

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

cogent_one

08/05/2011 05:18 PM

What if there is absolutely no doubt that a person has committed some ghastly crime like beating a child to death or starving it?  Or abducting a young girl and then raping and killing her? Or luring a girl to a forest and callously bashing her head in with a rock?

No-one is seeking the restitution of a draconian hanging policy: but many people feel that the worst crimes carry an insufficient penalty.

We have had no hesitation in killing large numbers of Iraqis, Afghans and Libyans recently: many of them completely innocent.  Yet horrendous psychopaths like Millie Dowler's murderer have a comfortable life in jail and are free to sue the prison authorities because they are attacked by their fellow inmates. Is that your idea of justice?

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

cogent_one surely they've only ever sentenced someone to death where they thought there was no doubt. And yet still got it wrong. Because we are human beings that make mistakes, we don't have the right to give a death sentence

morningstar

08/08/2011 11:20 AM

Yes we do ! Making a statement does not make it so !

The return of Capital punishment does not ensure its use ! If the deterrent effect saves a single truly innocent life then it is vindicated !

Yes the whole system needs cleaning out and yes it is possible that someone who is not guilty could die in error, but its availability or not can influence those who go out ready to commit crimes especially if they arm themselves ! That mistakes can be made does not preclude an option for the law even if it is never used !

cartimandua

08/05/2011 06:08 PM

Umm we have not killed lots of innocent Afghans the Taliban have and they would have killed more of them if we had not been there to prevent it.

cogent_one

08/05/2011 06:19 PM

We certainly have killed  many Afghans: mostly in misdirected air strikes. The Taliban have killed many more, no doubt.

 

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

hardworkingdadof5

08/05/2011 04:49 PM

As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works;

If put into practice, the Guildford 4, Stefan Kiscki, Barry George.....etc...etc....would be proof it doesn't

morningstar

08/08/2011 11:12 AM

Misdirection ! the death penalty was not available ! If it had been it maybe that the standard of proof would have been insufficient for a jury to find them gulity ! And they might not even have spent time in prison at all !

You just never know !

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

villain57

08/06/2011 01:22 AM

If you believe that the US as not executed innocents in over 100 years you are totally naive.

Caryl Chessman, Barbara Graham and many others have been executed while strong doubts exist about their innocence and many others have been proved innocent before their execution.

morningstar

08/08/2011 11:07 AM

Which makes the point ! Strong doubts are not proof of innocence and many innocents - did not get executed ! So the system works !

You walked yourself right into that one !

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

daviduk84

08/05/2011 05:33 PM

@strangerheremysel
"That you so easily resort to abuse rather than civilised rebuttal says much about you and your cause.

Death-penalty opponents do their utmost to make the victim vanish. While almost poetic in begging sympathy for convicted murderers, not one word can be spared for the victims. The executed are routinely depicted as if immaculately conceived and without sin, rather than meeting their end as a consequence of murdering another human being."

That is the best post we've had on here. It really hacks me off to the way death penalty opponents (I mean serious ones, not like whatshisname who is spamming this board) want to erase the crime and it's consequences from the picture. The way in which cold blooded psychopaths are depicted by them as almost Christ-like in their forbearance of the injustice heaped on them by a wicked society. Whilst at the same time, horrendously traumatised relatives whose lives have been utterly destroyed are ignored, or even ridiculed and demonised for wanting justice. 

I think the fact that they are raised in an atmosphere of politically correct moral relativism where criminals are victims, and wanton cruelty is merely a "cry for help" is a large part of it. So when some kid gets raped tortured and murdered by some sicko, they can't quite understand what the rest of us are getting so upset about.  They are like Morrisey with his "what happened in Norway was nothing compared to what happens in KFC every day" riff.

I'm not even really pro-death penalty, but this whole "if we execute them we're no better than them" attitude annoys me. It's like saying that becuase courts hand down fines they are no better than pick-pockets.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

villain57

08/06/2011 12:58 AM

Highly emotive. All murderers are cold blooded psychopaths and what about the families of those left behind.

In the real world of murder most victims are known to or related to the murderer and the family of the victim and perpetrator are the same. If a husband murders his wife and is then executed how does this help any children they have?

And state execution of any innocent person is a worse crime because it s done in society's name.

The idea presented that criminals are presented as victims is emotive tosh. They are tried and sent to prison for their crime, that is their punishment.

No one can console or replace the victim to their family. No matter what sympathy we have for the victim's family it will never heal their loss. Executing others (sometimes the wrong person) won't change that.

cartimandua

08/05/2011 06:05 PM

We are no better if we do not do whatever gives victims families some peace and at the very least that is not a derisory sentence

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

Henry Page

08/05/2011 11:45 PM

Think of the people who would have been executed though they were actually innocent: The Guildford Four, The Birmingham Six etc etc ... the death penalty is completely unacceptable. Life should mean life for 'aggravated murders'.

On a lighter note: http://gobbledegooked.wordpres...

morningstar

08/08/2011 10:36 AM

But they weren't were they ! The chances are that a more robust police force and criminal justice sytem would have established the case much more completely if there had been any chance of them swinging for it!

The state can be lax in prosecutions and investigations when they just have to chuck a wad of taxpayers money at someone wrongly convicted! They have to be much much more robust if they are going to send them to the hangman! They don't like it when they make mistakes - and they HAVE to take responsability when they get it wrong you see!

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

JessieXL

08/06/2011 12:45 AM

If you are in favour of the death penalty, then imagine how you would feel if it were you or someone you loved facing it, having been wrongly convicted.

You might change your mind about the value of those 'money-hungry lawyers and sympathetic liberals' who appeal your sentence.

Not_taken_in

08/06/2011 02:26 PM

Have you ever imagined what it would feel like to be looking down the barrel of a shotgun watching the trigger being squeezed and knowing that thanks to warped liberalism your killer would not pay with their own life and you would not have the option of giving them pause for thought as you would wish that you otherwise had ?

Who the hell are you to betray the undoubted outrage of a terrified murder victim. IT IS NOT ABOUT YOUR SQUEAMISH LIBERAL CONSCIENCE IT IS ABOUT THE VICTIM'S DEMAND FOR JUSTICE FROM BEYOND THE GRAVE.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

bifflogan

08/06/2011 12:56 AM

Imagine how you would feel if the murderer-rapist of your daughter was given life in prison where he earned a law degree, trimmed himself into great shape, eating well and working out, and 15 years later was paroled by a liberal bunch of criminal loving scumbags. Kill the murderers ASAP, pay per view.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

blue_streak

08/06/2011 09:49 AM

Just a few thoughts on this topic:

If the death penalty does not have a deterrent effect on people's behaviour, why are deserters shot in wars?  By all accounts it has proved to be effective in preventing desertions and it is credited with ending the mutiny by French soldiers on the Western front in World War I. 

To stop a rape wave in China a few decades ago, the government introduced the death penalty for rapists.  Within a short time, the rape wave was brought under control.

When advocates of the death penalty point to Singapore as an example of a country where it works, liberals say that Singapore's low murder rate is due to the greater sense of collective responsibility that is exhibited by Asian communities.

But liberals also point to the United States of an example of a country where the death penalty does not work. They do not attribute the high murder rate in the US to the individualism that is a defining characteristic of American society.

And finally, the following observation: I was in France in 1981 when the French abolished the death penalty.  The very next day there was a bloody attack on a hotel in Paris in which, if I remember rightly, about 8 people were killed.  The criminals had obviously waited until the law had been passed before beginning their violent escapade.

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

Toby Parker

08/07/2011 03:06 PM

Animals also rape, murder, and disembowel each other. Do you think we should do that, too? Animals kill their young - are you condoning child murder?

morningstar

08/08/2011 10:04 AM

Animals do none of the above - only we humans have the ability to 'classify' what we call crimes. To the animals - it is just life - they are born, exist, (hopefully) mate as often as possible and die ! There is not any other plan involved for them !

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

hardtruth01

08/06/2011 08:15 PM

"Have you ever imagined what it would feel like to be looking down the barrel of a shotgun watching the trigger being squeezed and knowing that .... your killer would not pay with their own life and you would not have the option of giving them pause for thought as you would wish that you otherwise had ? "

I suspect what  little "comfort" I'd take from knowing my killer would die too might be outweighed by the realization that, had the killer already used one barrel to kill another, he would, having killed once, have no disincentive whatever not to shoot me too.

 With regard to your capsrant,  you are confusing "justice" and "vengence" ,

morningstar

08/08/2011 09:52 AM

Someone who will kill without thought will not be deterred by the death penalty, lets not be under any illusion here! However the person who 'thinks' will be well aware that although they have committed a crime they will only be imprisoned for that crime and come out the other side - will more likely not kill if the option is there - because simply, if they are afraid of getting caught - they will be aware the the rope beckons if they step over the line!

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

chunkylimey

08/07/2011 11:58 PM

So if the state kills an innocent person for murder; because I hope you're not stupid enough to trust the state; you will of course compensate the victim of that mistake by killing yourself?

There would be no other suitable compensation.

morningstar

08/08/2011 09:45 AM

There is no link to be made here ! You are comparing apples with doughnuts !

Take that tissue away from your nose and start thinking about justice for the victim who has had their life taken away by a murderer. Think that maybe (and the stats are on my side here) that that innocent victim might survive a murderous encounter if the deterrant works ! Would you not rather risk (in a judicial setting) the chance that a jury would find you guilty (by mistake) than a murderer would not pull the trigger in order to get away !

I know with which I would rather take my chances ! You forget that before the abolition of the death penalty most criminals would go armed with non lethal weapons because they knew that to kill was to die - if they were caught ! What is more - they would go as far aspossible to ensure that their colleagues we unarmed as well !

Your whole argument is flawed because you are dealing with emotion and not fact ! Put away the handkerchief dearie !

Commenting on As Britain debates the death penalty again, studies from America confirm that it works (By Tim Stanley US politics Last updated: August 5th, 2011)

chunkylimey

08/07/2011 11:52 PM

Your point doesn't address the key issue. How do you compensate for a mistake when someone has been executed in error?

Are you going to try and claim that the justice system is faultless and that we should trust the government?

Are you willing to be executed for the murder of the first innocent person to be killed by the death penalty since you supported it? If you're not willing to risk your own life why should you be so glad to risk the lives of others?

strangerheremyself

08/08/2011 09:41 AM

Life is risk: weighing costs and benefits. You take a risk by going into hospital—even the best nurses, doctors and surgeons make mistakes, have off-days, and some manage to qualify who should not. But the benefits of modern medicine outweigh the risk of the occasional mistake. A mistake occurs, an inquiry is held, very occasionally it is so serious as to warrant criminal charges; sometimes the medical practitioner is struck off; other times changes are made in procedure; sometimes, it’s just life.

Risk is involved in all human activity: 2,946 deaths on the roads in 2007, 646 of them pedestrians (‘But I’m innocent! I don’t even own a car!’)—shall we ban motorised transport? Trains crash. Aeroplanes crash. Ships sink. Horses throw their riders. People even die in accidents in the building trade. If you cannot accept any death by mistake then you end all human activity whatsoever.

However, the risk of a respectable, law-abiding citizen of being wrongly accused of murder is vanishingly small.